From firstname.lastname@example.org Organization All USENET -- http://www.Supernews.com Date Thu, 26 Mar 1998 20:47:39 -0800 Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <email@example.com>
Our Troop will be going to Philmont this summer and I have a few questions about food and cooking. Do they use dehydrated or canned food? What type of stoves do they use? I read in their guide they issue trail kits with 8, 6 and 4 quart pots. My experience with backpack stoves, we use MSR XGK/Wisper Lites, suggests a 2 quart pot is ideal. I would think it might be difficult using an 8 quart pot with those stoves; the 4 qt might be acceptable. Any feedback or suggestions would be appreciated. YIS - Kerry
Re: Philmont Food & Cooking
From firstname.lastname@example.org (Alan Houser) Organization "emf.net" Quality Internet Access. (510) 704-3800 (login: guest) Date 27 Mar 1998 06:43:02 GMT Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <email@example.com>
Depends on the size of your crew. In '93, we had 9 in our crew and we used the 8 quart pots with the same MSR stoves you have. Worked fine. As for the food itself, the dinners were mainly freeze dried, but the other meals were a mixture of some dry food (including boxed cereals & crackers), some wet (squeeze cheese!), and some canned (the infamous spreadables!). YiS, Alan R. Houser ** firstname.lastname@example.org ** Scoutmaster, Troop 24, Berkeley, California ** ** WWW page ** http://www.emf.net/~troop24/t24.html ** Scoutmaster, Mt. Diablo Silverado Council Jamboree Troop #637 ** http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Trails/9637/ **
From Tim Hewitt <email@example.com> Organization Fairchild Semiconductor Date Fri, 27 Mar 1998 13:05:59 -0500 Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <351BEA7F.877689DF@fairchildsemi.com>
The only thing you need to be concerned about using large pots on your Wisperlite is stability. There are two general methods to deal with this: 1) Place the stove between two parallel logs that hold the pot 2) Place the stove beneath a standup grill that holds the pot. I've used both, and in fact found a small folding grill in Campmor that fits over my Apex II stove perfectly - about 1/2" of clearance with a 6 qt pot full of water on top. -Tim -- Tim Hewitt, Scoutmaster Troop 350, Old Orchard Beach, Maine
From firstname.lastname@example.org (Eric Nelson) Organization Altair Engineering, Inc. Date 27 Mar 1998 19:37:50 GMT Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <email@example.com>
Some good suggestions so far so I'll just relate a couple thoughts from my years as a Philmont ranger. 1-bring your own stoves. Philmont's get pretty banged up. 2-Philmonts pots work fine and you really need the big one to cook for more than 4 people (b/c the food comes in packs for 4). 3-no horse play around the stove....yes I've seen frisbees ruin dinner. 4-make sure all the kids know how to use the stoves you bring before you get there. I think that's the number one thing I had to teach kids as a ranger. They'd almost always been taught about backpacks and hiking boots, etc. but I think the adults ususally 'handled' the stoves on their shake down trips so consequently many of the kids hadn't ever lit the stoves or handled the fuel. Obviously safety is important so some monitoring is required the first time. 5-whisper lites are superior to peak 1 stoves mainly b/c no pouring of fuel is required. Either will boil water. Use the windscreens on the stoves as this well really improve efficiency. Have Fun! Eric Nelson
From Wolfman <firstname.lastname@example.org> Organization WorldWide Access - Midwestern Internet Services - www.wwa.com Date Fri, 27 Mar 1998 10:21:42 -0600 Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <Pine.OSF.3.96.980327101836.21924Aemail@example.com>
I went to Philmont 2 years ago. We brought two MSR Whisperlites and the pots issued by Philmont worked great. For the most part the food is dehydrated. Most of the lunches are made for on the go eating. So they are canned meats, squeeze cheese (Great Stuff, Ha, Ha) or peanut butter and jelly and most came with some sort of crackers. Also enjoy the Pemican bars for breakfast. ~~~~*****OOOO@@) +---------------------------------+ _______ ___,---. ---+_______:_ | Philip E. Scherry ||_______| |_______| |__|________|_ | Student | oo oo ~ ooo ooo ~ oOOOO- OOOO=o\ | Christian Brothers University 0-----------------------------------0 | Memphis, TN | WELCOME | | (901)321-3874 |to the Informantion Superhighway...| | http://www.cbu.edu/~pscherry | AOL users, stay to the right! | +-------------------------------0-----------------------------------0 ... ERROR: This error message was issued in error. Please ignore.
From firstname.lastname@example.org Organization All USENET -- http://www.Supernews.com Date 27 Mar 1998 06:03:21 GMT Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <email@example.com>
I think most troops don't rent the stoves there but bring their own. The MSR stoves should work fine. Remember that, if you're traveling by air, it's theoretically illegal to bring used fuel containers along. (At the very least, don't bring any fuel on the airplane -- buy it there). Dan Hicks Hey!! My advice is free -- take it for what it's worth! http://www.millcomm.com/~danhicks
From Wolfman <firstname.lastname@example.org> Organization WorldWide Access - Midwestern Internet Services - www.wwa.com Date Fri, 27 Mar 1998 16:25:51 -0600 Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <Pine.OSF.3.96.980327162417.20289Aemail@example.com>
> 3-no horse play around the stove....yes I've seen frisbees > ruin dinner. Why would frisbees ruin dinner when you eat off of them? That is the best thing to take for a personal dish. Food then Fun. ~~~~*****OOOO@@) +---------------------------------+ _______ ___,---. ---+_______:_ | Philip E. Scherry ||_______| |_______| |__|________|_ | Student | oo oo ~ ooo ooo ~ oOOOO- OOOO=o\ | Christian Brothers University 0-----------------------------------0 | Memphis, TN | WELCOME | | (901)321-3874 |to the Informantion Superhighway...| | http://www.cbu.edu/~pscherry | AOL users, stay to the right! | +-------------------------------0-----------------------------------0 ... ERROR: This error message was issued in error. Please ignore.
From Donald Lent <firstname.lastname@example.org> Organization dlent Date Sat, 28 Mar 1998 12:58:49 -0500 Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <351D3A58.61FC5408@erols.com>
Perhaps by knocking the pot over <:). yis, Don Lent Former ASM T1392 NCAC
From email@example.com (Eric Nelson) Organization Altair Engineering, Inc. Date 30 Mar 1998 13:06:13 GMT Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Sorry, I didn't mean don't use the frisbees for either eating or fun. I was referring to a time when a frisbee was thrown across the campsite and broadsided the stove with our dinner on it. Obviously, not a good thing to have going on.....
From Chris Lange <email@example.com> Organization Trib.com Date Wed, 01 Apr 1998 00:28:26 -0700 Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <3521EC9A.B34982E@trib.com>
Teach the kids to aim, the bears don't need anymore food than the staff feed to them (and people wonder where there crew members went!) I want to go back to Philmont! -Urraca Staff Member 1997
From Rik Bergethon <firstname.lastname@example.org> Organization Rocky Mountain Internet - 1(800)-900-RMII Date Sat, 28 Mar 1998 07:29:15 -0700 Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <351D093B.3ADB@rmi.net>
if you arrive by train, you will be bussed from Raton. Ask the driver to stop at the grocery store in Cimarron before he make the turn to Philmont. Get your stove fuel there. If you fly in, you will be bussed up from Albuquerque. Do the same, get it at the grocery store in Cimarron. If you drive, bring your own. Don't use the dual fuel stoves with unleaded gas. You will be over 10,00 feet at times and unleaded gas just doesn't heat as well at that altitude. Use the white gas.
From email@example.com (Meirose) Organization AOL http://www.aol.com Date 30 Mar 1998 16:53:58 GMT Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <1998033016535801.LAA05747@ladder03.news.aol.com>
OK, you can choose to listen to me (3 years as an attendant at Philmont (88, 90, 92) and then 2 years as a Ranger and a year as Trail Crew Foreman (94-96) or ignore me, but I believe that I am one of the more competent people who will respond to your post. The Food: All Suppers require cooking (this does not mean you must eat that particular meal at supper, but that is for another discussion). All of these meals are dehydrated food. For the best success when cooking them, make sure that you allow enough time for them to hydrate properly before you cook them. This keeps them from being chewy, and it also keeps that food from sucking water out of your body to properly hydrate itself while in your stomach. Bring a nice assortment of spices (Italian spices, Cayane pepper, Curry, cinnamon, and a good bottle of hot sauce) with you and you can improve the taste of the meals considerably, not to say that they are bad though. Be warned, all the meals are mush, and they are one of the stickest substances known to man if allowed to dry on pans/dishes/scouts. Someone reccomended the one pot meal (combining everything into one pot) and I too subscribe to this train of thought on most of the meals. Don't combine desseart with the main course (you're saying Duh right....but I have seen it happen.) As far as your canned food question, the only canned food that Philmont uses is an item that is called Spreadibles. It comes in 3 different lunch packets, but you might get lucky and only get 2 of those 3 meals while at Philmont. Spreadibles are Tuna, chicken, or Ham (and one other I cannot come up with) with a mayonase base and a mixture of veggies (like a tuna salad sandwich). Be careful with these, because the lids are very sharp. You can also occasionally get canned peaches from various food pick-ups (Base camp, Baldy Town, Phillips Junction, Ute Gulch) and on rare occassion, you might get a gift from a staff camp that might be canned. If you go to Philmont late in the summer, you might be able to bum cans of Spam from the staffed camps--they occassionally collect these over the duration of the summer. As far as other cooked meals, there used to be numerous breakfast that were cooked, but now they have narrowed this down to the pancake breakfast (this takes much longer than you expect to cook as a warning) and boiling water for oatmeal. As for the Trail Kits for cooking your needs will vary depending upon the size of your crew. They will discuss this with you in base camp before you hit the trail, and if you have a competent Ranger, he/she too will help you with this. Unless things have changed in the last year, Phimont has been using two different cook sets. The newer style are stainless steel, but are smaller in size. The old ones are Aluminum and bigger. I have used both, and each has advantages over the other. Both sets of pots work very well with backpacking stoves. The keys to this is making sure that the base of the stove is level and stable, and that you center the pot on the stove before releasing the handle. Stoves with wind shields are more efficient. MSR and Peak One are the most common types of stoves used at Philmont. I reccommend highly that you bring your own stoves, because Philmonts are not in the greatest of shape, especially once you get deeper into the summer. As far as fuel, you can buy white gas at Philmont (Base Camp and all food pick-ups) If your fuel bottles have a capacity of 3-4 liters you should not have a problem of running out of fuel between food pick-ups unless you spill an enormous amount, or you allow your stoves to run senselessly (nobody needs a cup of coffee every hour while backpacking). I have heard/ seen very few problems with the Philmont fuel. It is not a pure as the Coleman out of a can fuel, but it still works. The only problems I ever remember was with an older MSR whisper-lite before they had the self cleaning spray valves. One important suggestion--bring more than one stove. Some people choose to not bring two, and they regret it later. It makes cooking go faster, clean-up faster, and it provides security to all involved that they will get something hot to eat at least once a day. The Philmont suppers are not very good cold. I speak from experience. Make sure you know how to fix your stoves. DO NOT BRING new never used on a campout stoves!! The boys all must know how to operate the stoves. Take them on campouts this spring and use them. Practice at troop meetings by boiling water for hot chocolate or something. Require that all your boys know how to cook before going to Philmont--cooking merit badge is a good prerequsite as is camping MB. The use of leather gloves are occasionally nice while cooking and moving pots. The only other reccomendation I have is FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS on the package. It makes a BIG difference if the package says add contents and bring to a boil or bring to a boil and add contents. They know what they are talking about in the instructions. The keys to Philmont are have fun, and allow the boys to be the leaders, and be prepaired. The adults are on Vacation. Chris Meirose Chris Meirose firstname.lastname@example.org Go Sonics!!
From email@example.com (Josh Hesse) Organization CANeM///Cabal Academic Network Monitoring///[tinc] Date 31 Mar 1998 07:51:47 GMT Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Meirose (email@example.com) wrote: : Spreadibles are Tuna, chicken, or Ham (and one other I cannot come up with) Turkey Spreadibles. Belive it or not, when I went on a trek in '93, I actually liked the spreadibles.(much to the disbelife of a freind who went to the Nat. Jamboree and had them EVERY DAY...) In '96, I was unable to finish a can that turned up in our swap box... -Josh -- Do not send mail to this account. Really. "Talk about silly conspiracy theories..." -Wayne Schlitt in unl.general This post (C)1998, Josh Hesse. Quoted material is (C) of the person quoted. |ess|erb|unl|u| (Oo) MYTHOS How's my posting? 1-800-DEV-NULL email: jh|e@h|ie.|.ed| /||\ NEW AEON .Sigfile freshness date: 3/6/98 "Nazi Nazi Nazi!" -James Driscoll, aka <firstname.lastname@example.org>
From Nathan Beauheim <"beauheim"@cae#$%^&*.wisc.edu> Organization University of Wisconsin, Madison Date Tue, 31 Mar 1998 10:33:09 -0600 Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <email@example.com>
When I went to Jamboree in '93, we obtained a can of peanut butter from our commisary and used that with left over jelly and bread from breakfast to make PB&J sandwhiches. A significant improval over the Spreadibles. We gave the Spreadibles to the other troop from our council, who loaded them into their cart and marched around the sub-camp singing about how much they hated Spreadibles. FWIW, we were Troop 506 and our other troop was 507. We were also very good at obtaining extra ice cream from the commisary, but we had trouble with it melting before we could eat it and actually had to take some back uneaten. Last year, on staff (OA Service Corps), I never got the lunches that contained Spreadibles. I always got the ones that had the two packets of peanut butter, two packets of jelly, and graham crackers. Those are pretty good, unless you eat them for lunch and dinner on the same day, which Service Corps did on the day the president came. It wouldn't have been so bad if we could have eaten our dinner in one serving, but we kept having to go do stuff while we were eating. Such is the life. -- Nathan Beauheim ASM Troop 140 Middleton WI beauheim@cae#$%^&*.wisc.edu (remove the #$%^&*) Remember: A Scout is Hungry.
From firstname.lastname@example.org (Schmittdas) Organization AOL http://www.aol.com Date 2 Apr 1998 02:04:50 GMT Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <1998040202045000.VAA17505@ladder03.news.aol.com>
Very Good reply Chris... Remember to bring a camp cup with measuring marks on it.. Usually about 75 cents. It will help with the mashed potatoes or is it potatoe soup tonight. There was once a Beef spreadable, but I ate the one can.. Fuel: watch out for the fuel bottles with the pouring caps that you "just" twist open. The sand and dirt will clog the treads. Bring a 3x4 foot plastic tarp to lay out clean utensils and food prep. Marks out wher not to step. Say hi to Becky in the Craft Lodge..this summer. An remember her DAD is watching you.
From email@example.com (Schmittdas) Organization AOL http://www.aol.com Date 2 Apr 1998 01:48:49 GMT Newsgroups rec.scouting.usa Message-ID <1998040201484901.UAA11907@ladder01.news.aol.com>
On the macscouter web site www.macscouter.com is a cook book called Philmont Country Cookbook. It contains a listing of the food packages / menus use on the trecks a few years ago. It varies from year to year. But should give you an idea. The large pot will fit over a sleeping bag. Our group used Coleman single burner stoves. Enjoy your trip.
Philmont food memories: Tetrox
From: "Richard Swent" <Richard.nospam.Swent@nospam.Stanford.edu> Newsgroups: rec.scouting.usa Subject: Philmont food memories: Tetrox Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:29:57 -0800 Organization: Stanford University Message-ID: <6g0ee5$f3n$1@nntp.Stanford.EDU> Reply-To: <Richard.Swent@stanford.edu.nospam>
The posts about Philmont food brought back memories of my visit to Philmont. I really don't remember the food, but I do remember the soap they gave us to clean the dishes. It was called Tetrox, and it came in little packets of greenish powder. It was supposed to work well in cold and hard water, but we were warned to rinse everything extremenly well or we would get the "Tetrox Trots". The stuff worked great, and I snitched a few packets to take home with me to show the other scouts on one of our troop campouts. On one such campout we were in bear country and were warned to protect all our food from bears, which I did. It turns out, though, that the sweet perfumey smell of a bag of Tetrox attracted one bear to raid my backpack. The next morning I found my pocket ripped and the empty bag of Tetrox on the ground. We all got a big laugh imagining what a bad case of trots that bear was going to have! Anyway, I learned a lesson about perfumes and now I also hang soap, toothpaste and any other thing that might smell good.